FP3, The Auto-Tune Process Explained
- Thread starter Spazz
- Start date
When I was at J&P Cycles open house this summer I asked the V&H guys about running a de-catted stock head pipe (Rush Big Louie's slip -ons) and auto tune. He told me to run the V&H Hi-output slip-ons / power duals map and not to use the AT because of cross-talk with the O2 sensors. So I switched from the auto tuned map I was running back to the base map he suggested , more popping and "bang" type back fires on decel even with the decel set to off ?
I was talking to Dave at Fuel Moto the other day , I mentioned this O2 cross talk to him , his response was there not so sure thats more of a myth than fact in reality.
I switched back to my Auto tuned Hi-output slip-on / power dual map I had saved today, I wished I would have sooner , much better performance all around , no more decel BANG backfires and almost no popping now plus the response is noticeably better all across the RPM range especially about 2200 - 4000.
Myth busted :
I'm going to side with Dave at Fuel Moto on this and say run the Auto tune with a de-catted head pipe in spite of V&H's recommendation , something tells me V&H's haven't really tried it , possibly to avoid the watchful eye's of the EPA by promoting modifying emission's equipment and / or to sell more of there head pipes.
I was talking to Dave at Fuel Moto the other day , I mentioned this O2 cross talk to him , his response was there not so sure thats more of a myth than fact in reality.
I switched back to my Auto tuned Hi-output slip-on / power dual map I had saved today, I wished I would have sooner , much better performance all around , no more decel BANG backfires and almost no popping now plus the response is noticeably better all across the RPM range especially about 2200 - 4000.
Myth busted :
I'm going to side with Dave at Fuel Moto on this and say run the Auto tune with a de-catted head pipe in spite of V&H's recommendation , something tells me V&H's haven't really tried it , possibly to avoid the watchful eye's of the EPA by promoting modifying emission's equipment and / or to sell more of there head pipes.
Just got my fp3 today and did a bit of tuning. It seems to want a lot more time per cell than the power vision did! I tried doing some low gear full throttle from 2k-5k rpm and it barely turned anything green outside the 'normal cruising area' of the map. Gotta try again to get more of the map green.
I wasn't sure what map to start with. I picked twin slash with quiet cores since I figured that would be close to my stock pipes with a 1" hole in the end. Emailed v&h for a suggested map a few days ago and no response.
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I wasn't sure what map to start with. I picked twin slash with quiet cores since I figured that would be close to my stock pipes with a 1" hole in the end. Emailed v&h for a suggested map a few days ago and no response.
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Yeah.. FP3 needs alot more time per cell than the 7 hits it takes the PV to populate a cell. There is no hit count to go by...you just have to monitor your targeted cells and keep at it until they populate
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FYI I just read through the faq section of the app and it says that an orange cell indicates it has learned information for 1 cylinder while green indicates it's learned data for both. Of course it's hard to tell which cylinder it has learned for, but I'm working on that (by manually putting all cell values in a spreadsheet to compare canned values vs auto tune learned values). This is where having a computer application really helps, as the dynojet software allows you to view deltas between any value in any map as well as smooth a range as desired. Too late, the fp3 is paid for and married!
I haven't spent enough time with the fp3 yet, but based on the dynojet maps I've looked at, front and rear cylinder ve tables follow roughly the same trends so with enough information and auto tune sessions I could fine tune the tables and smooth out some cells. It's going to take time and fuel to get it done, and of course without a dyno run there's really to telling if what I think is good truly is.
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I haven't spent enough time with the fp3 yet, but based on the dynojet maps I've looked at, front and rear cylinder ve tables follow roughly the same trends so with enough information and auto tune sessions I could fine tune the tables and smooth out some cells. It's going to take time and fuel to get it done, and of course without a dyno run there's really to telling if what I think is good truly is.
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I just returned from my 1K maintenance and I also had V&H Dresser Duals, Rinehart 4" mufflers, and a SE A/C setup installed.
I told the service manager that I had already installed an V&H FP3 and mapped it to my bike with the stock map.
They said they would re-map it for me and that it was not an issue for them.
Driving the bike home she sounded great and I had no reason to think there is any issue with the updates .... including the re-mapping.
After pulling into my garage I throttled up a little and heard a single pop .....
Then I connected my IPhone to the FP3 to check which map they flashed ..... It was the V&H Monster Rounds w/Dresser Duals ..... And Throttle Progessivity was set at Advanced
I had read some previous posts that indicated other maps flashed were Power Duals or Dresser Dual with Hi-Output slips on .....
I told the service manager that I had already installed an V&H FP3 and mapped it to my bike with the stock map.
They said they would re-map it for me and that it was not an issue for them.
Driving the bike home she sounded great and I had no reason to think there is any issue with the updates .... including the re-mapping.
After pulling into my garage I throttled up a little and heard a single pop .....
Then I connected my IPhone to the FP3 to check which map they flashed ..... It was the V&H Monster Rounds w/Dresser Duals ..... And Throttle Progessivity was set at Advanced
I had read some previous posts that indicated other maps flashed were Power Duals or Dresser Dual with Hi-Output slips on .....
Thanks Spazz for your write up. It was very informative.
Got my FP3 and installed Thursday and the canned map seemed pretty flawless. Decided to try out the auto tune today while out on a charity ride. It ran a little rough in the morning till the engine warmed up. I got about 175 miles in. But here is the results.
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Got my FP3 and installed Thursday and the canned map seemed pretty flawless. Decided to try out the auto tune today while out on a charity ride. It ran a little rough in the morning till the engine warmed up. I got about 175 miles in. But here is the results.
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Good lookin and solid map for a 175 miles trip. Also... while in AT... the scoot will run a rough idle and maybe even show signs of hesitation at times. It will all go away AFTER you complete the AT.
Little work on higher TPS ( rollons to WOT from 1700 rpms in 2nd 3rd and 4th) to get that section of the map populated, but really good for what you did... no joke... no gaps except for one@ 3000rpms and 25% TPS.... not a big deal....
Little work on higher TPS ( rollons to WOT from 1700 rpms in 2nd 3rd and 4th) to get that section of the map populated, but really good for what you did... no joke... no gaps except for one@ 3000rpms and 25% TPS.... not a big deal....
I noticed an updated FP3 app came out yesterday (at least for iOS). It includes "Autotune customization". Has anybody had the opportunity to try and understand the new additions and whether it makes sense to go back through the autotune process based on these additions? Going through the demo mode, you can see all the changes.
Thank you Spazz.... hopefully I can get time to get most of the rest dialed in.
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I just received this reply back from V&H regarding my mapping question (sent 09/11) ......
My Message: I am installing V&H Dresser Duals, Rinehart 4" exhaust and Harley Davidson, Screamin Eagle A/C .... I have an FP3 installed that is currently mapped to the stock configuration for my 2016 FLHSX.
What would be the map I would flash using my FP3?
Please advise.
*****
Reply:
For that setup, use V&H Twin Slash Round slip ons w/Dresser Duals as the base map.
My Message: I am installing V&H Dresser Duals, Rinehart 4" exhaust and Harley Davidson, Screamin Eagle A/C .... I have an FP3 installed that is currently mapped to the stock configuration for my 2016 FLHSX.
What would be the map I would flash using my FP3?
Please advise.
*****
Reply:
For that setup, use V&H Twin Slash Round slip ons w/Dresser Duals as the base map.
